Crossover jig Questions.

kenrhodes

  I have a decent amount of the CAD work done for the Meniscus crossover jig kit and have even ordered some parts to build a prototype of what i hope will be the final unit. 
  Currently the design has the ability to "live" switch between 2 different stereo crossovers. The jig uses relays to isolate the two crossovers. This can be run biamped as well as a common input. This same jig can be used to A/B portions of the circuit as well making it so that you can test different capacitors, L-pads, inductors you name it. The Jig will be a 8 1/2 by 11 inch laser etched/cut plywood board that will have all the connections on the top surface.
  The switch to control A/B will plug into binding post so that the user can be sitting in the listening position and flip the switch for A/B without changing their listening position (sorry you will have to add your own remote if you want one).

I would love to have some input on what type of connectors that you all would prefer to have on the jig. The original from last years Meniscus event had spring terminals. They were cheep and they filled a need, beyond that they kinda sucked the only advantage that they bring to the table is price at $.50 each. In an effort to make a more user friendly project I would like to consider other options... please post your preference number 1-5 and post any helpful criticisms that you can think of. Thanks.


2:

3:

4:

5:

dcibel

Your first photo offers great bang for the buck. You won't be disappointed with those. Also consider Speakon connectors, they're great and inexpensive.

rjj45

I'm now using a 2nd iteration of a crossover proto board. 
I like dual banana posts for input from the amp. You can stack dual banana plugs to power additional boards if you are working on a 3 way, for example.  For internal connectors, I prefer the spring loaded terminals like #3, but I'm also thinking about using crocodile clips (edit - does not look like anyone carries crocodile clips anymore) - IME, alligator clips are pretty marginal for a crossover board - 2 components are good, but 3 components on a single clip is marginal.
You will also need a lot of jumpers. I ended up making my own with large insulated alligator clips and soldering 18G wires to them.  Another question is if you will have ground plane pins on the board. You always need them, but they can limit flexibility.

dcibel

Fwiw I've had plenty of issues with the connection quality of alligator clips, adding an ohm or more to the circuit. I take impedance measurement and it looks high, jiggle the clip and it comes back to normal. Depending on location in the circuit it can be quite detrimental, so I try to avoid them at all costs.

Have a look at wago lever nuts as an alternative to alligators, these things are great and with multiple poles you can connect many wires together easily.

PWRRYD

+1 on the Wego nuts!  I use them a lot.  I also bought some higher quality alligator clips from Allied Electronics and made my own test clip leads with 18 gauge hookup wire.  I crimped and soldered the wires to the clips.  They work really well.

https://www.amazon.com/WAGO-222-413-LEVER-NUTS-Conductor-Connectors/dp/B000JJPA66/ref=asc_df_B000JJPA66/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=193984242218&hvpos=1o2&hvnetw=g&hvrand=16593761536469182600&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9021890&hvtargid=pla-314836175243&psc=1

PWRRYD

https://www.alliedelec.com/product/mueller/bu-60/70188572/

rjj45

dcibel said:

Fwiw I've had plenty of issues with the connection quality of alligator clips, adding an ohm or more to the circuit. I take impedance measurement and it looks high, jiggle the clip and it comes back to normal. Depending on location in the circuit it can be quite detrimental, so I try to avoid them at all costs.

Have a look at wago lever nuts as an alternative to alligators, these things are great and with multiple poles you can connect many wires together easily.

My experience exactly. My last tuning session, I had so many problems, that's when I ended up doubling the cheap jumpers, making my own jumpers, and adding additional alligator clips if I had any doubt about a solid connection. The Wagos look great, and are very reasonably priced, so thanks!  On to the 3rd iteration of my crossover boards with the wagos.
I'm still not strong on the Arduino/relay thing yet, though, but A/B switching would be effing awesome.

jhollander

Of what's shown I like the push to open spring terminals of #3.  My go to is the euro style terminal blocks and soldered but not twisted connections between parts and wire. I like to solder...

ani_101

I like #3 just for the simplicity of quickly connecting twisted bare wire. But #1 or #2, #4 can also take care wires. Spring clip seem the worse as i am never sure what kind of connections they are making, wires too close together, etc

ani_101

PWRRYD said:

+1 on the Wego nuts!  I use them a lot.  I also bought some higher quality alligator clips from Allied Electronics and made my own test clip leads with 18 gauge hookup wire.  I crimped and soldered the wires to the clips.  They work really well.

https://www.amazon.com/WAGO-222-413-LEVER-NUTS-Conductor-Connectors/dp/B000JJPA66/ref=asc_df_B000JJPA66/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=193984242218&hvpos=1o2&hvnetw=g&hvrand=16593761536469182600&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9021890&hvtargid=pla-314836175243&psc=1

These Wago thingies look interesting and pretty cheap for the pack. Anyway to secure them down to the board or wood or just glue them down?

Wolf

Just remember that switching while under load at higher power is not a good thing, and some compensation should likely be added to something that is made for this kind of contraption. I went through a bunch of this kind of thing when others were helping me in the 3-pair switcher. You don't want something to fry.

That said, I vote number 1, but you may also find that the Sure branded 4pc mini-insulated jacks are also cost effective. Those and Neutrik Speakons are what I used on my switcher.

4thtry

Thanks for all your hard work on this, Ken.  Looks like your project is starting to come together well.

I vote for the #1 dual banana jack for all jig connections.  This way, I can quickly connect and disconnect my xovers using cheap dual banana plugs.

I don't like the cheap #5 spring clips at all.  Numbers 2,3, and 4 would also be OK, but only if the spacing distance is standardized so that I can use use dual banana plugs on my end.

Bill

PWRRYD

ani_101 said:

PWRRYD said:

+1 on the Wego nuts!  I use them a lot.  I also bought some higher quality alligator clips from Allied Electronics and made my own test clip leads with 18 gauge hookup wire.  I crimped and soldered the wires to the clips.  They work really well.

https://www.amazon.com/WAGO-222-413-LEVER-NUTS-Conductor-Connectors/dp/B000JJPA66/ref=asc_df_B000JJPA66/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=193984242218&hvpos=1o2&hvnetw=g&hvrand=16593761536469182600&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9021890&hvtargid=pla-314836175243&psc=1

These Wago thingies look interesting and pretty cheap for the pack. Anyway to secure them down to the board or wood or just glue them down?

Ani,

I only use those Wego nuts for prototyping crossovers and other circuits.  I always twist together and solder all electrical connections on final builds.

Billet

I like spring clips but for prototyping and attending DIY events #1 is probably best.  It is much harder to accidentally short a banana jack and they are faster to changeover also.  I've been converted...

kenrhodes

  Thank you all for your help! I will commit to #1 it seems to have the majority favorite and offer the least amount of compromises. I like #3 as well but hate that it eliminates the use of banana's.
  I acknowledge that amplifiers hate switching the load like this but cannot find a better solution than relays. This will present an immediate disconnection and re-connection to the amplifier. Please make sure that your amplifier is up to the task. Typically class AB would be the best suited to this load type as a class A or D will both have a very negative reaction to this type of switching. Class A and D need a load for output regulation, Some class D amplifiers will have disconnection protection engendered into the design some do not (ask me how I know).

Wolf

Most pro amps should be okay, as they are designed to be robust and survive faults. I've not had trouble with the Drivecore Crowns using my relay switch. I do have CR filters at the input before the switch portion so the amp remains terminated, as well as fused outputs, and avalanche MOVs across the outputs. Just remember that these caps and coils store energy, and arcing potential, read: high voltage, can be caused by switching these parts under load. That is what can fry your amp here, and is why I installed these protections. Please, make sure this is not something that will take out your your amp. Please do not use tube amps with something such as this.