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What software do you use?
Hi Gents, been a while, hope all of you are well.
I have only ever used Jeff’s Excel programs for speaker design. It appears my old laptop I used those on has bitten the dust. So I probably should learn to use something that works on a modern platform vs trying to keep a windows 10 / excel 2007 setup running.
What programs do you all use? It needs to be easy to understand and use for my simple mind lol. I really enjoyed using Jeff’s programs.
Thanks!
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Sure a4eaudio will love to jump in here heh.... VituixCAD the choice for many of us.
I was forced off PCD too a while ago. I switched to WinPCD. It's acoustic offset method is nice and easy to work with for getting reasonable results with only a handfull of measurements.
Guys get some awesome results with ViituixCAD but they need to do a bunch more measurements to get it dialed in if I understand correctly.
I have been trying to learn "good" 2 channel measurements and importing into Vituixcad. Still not quite "up tp speed" on that. In the meantime, I can take some quick measurements in Omnimic and use Xsim to get me into the ballpark with crossover tuning. May not be as pure as Vituixcad, but measures and sounds good.
Thanks much! I appreciate the info!
I think vituixcad may be a little too in depth for me and I see WinPCD is based on Jeff’s programs. I thought I remembered a program being like that but forgot what it was. That will likely be the ticket for me.
Do either of these programs have a hilbert bode transform for extracting minimum phase?
2 channel measurement with VituixCAD!!
So the reasons why those of us who use VituixCAD (with a 2 channel measurement setup) love it...
EDIT: It does have an option to extract minimum phase, but it is discouraged since good 2-channel measurement won't need it. The author of the program is (violently) opposed to USB-Mics / single channel measurements.
Wow great info!
So what would I need to replace my omnimic with for the 2 ch in vituixcad?
Also, a great loss to me would be Jeff’s baffle step tool and also the woofer box tool that modeled excursion.
Can either of these do those functions? Edit- I see you said vituixcad has box modeling so I assume baffle step estimation/sim may be rolled into that?
I sound like my grandpa asking how to internet someone.. thanks for all the help, truly appreciated
Here is a link to my adventure down the 2 channel path. It was a fairly involved transition and took me a little time to adapt. But now I find it fairly easy to quickly set things up and take a set of measurements.
https://diy.midwestaudio.club/discussion/1824/building-an-inexpensive-2-channel-measurement-system/p1
The link that Bill (4thtry) posted is a good thread and helped me build a similar jig. BUT...note you don't need the jig. It helps if you want to have an impedance jig rather than DATS and want an easy way to add a cap in series to protect tweeters. But what you need is a 2-input, 2-output audio interface (Behringer UMC202HD, Motu M2, Focusrite 2i2 Scarlett, Steinberg UR22 MkII or whatever the newer version is) and a calibrated electret mic (Dayton EMM-6, Sonarworks, Audix, Line Audio OM1, Earthworks, etc.) And you would need to build a basic turntable so that you can take measurements from 0 to 180 degrees in 10 degree increments. If you go this route, I can post some links to people's turntable builds.
Yes, VituixCAD does both.
Yeah seems some folks forget this is a hobby and different people have different lines between leisure and work. For me if it gets too complicated I stop having fun. Then it's like I'm still at work. And I'm a work to live, not live to work kind of person.
Tell it, brother!
Thanks so much guys, I appreciate it and feel a bit better with the learning curve of vituixcad which seems to do it all knowing there are a bunch of you with it that I can get guidance from if I get stuck.
Sometimes I like to tweak on old builds so I will probably re-model my legacy stuff in WinISD and try new stuff in vituixcad.
I haven’t had a chance to read your link yet Bill but that will be a big help.
If the jig being referenced is the typical limp jig I actually already have one so that would be a bonus.
Thanks!
I hear you!
I'm way behind the times with XSim, REW, and UniBox.
I still use Unibox. I really like it.
I use S&L WT2, OMNIMIC V1, PCD8 or Xsim, and am trying to familiarize myself with Vituixcad.
InDIYana Event Website
Boxsim in general, and Micka.de for enclosure tuning
Micka.de is a very powerful program, but cantankerous as crud to set up. However, It happens to model what others don't.
InDIYana Event Website
I have been poking around on Vituix now for several months now and enjoying it. I am still at basic level but it has helped me to understand passive filters better. I make omnimic measurements 0 to 90 Horizontal every fifteen degrees for each driver and a on axis combined to load in as an overlay to figure time delay on the woofer. I have not loaded any vertical polars because I try to keep me drivers spaced tight. 3/4 wavelength or less. for now it's enough for this computer challenged guy
I think- Better the tool you know, than the tool you don’t. And important to know one’s limitations.
We all have different journeys to go along.
Including a Danish startup called Borrensen:
MLSSA, Praxis, WinMLS, Omnimic, Xsim, lspCAD, SoundEasy, Speakerworkshop, (Win)PCD can ALL help you design something with this type of frequency response. ^
The author of VituixCAD already had a Clio measurement system, and an Outline electronic turntable, so naturally he developed it with bi-plane 360 degree measurements in mind. If memory serves me correctly, the dual channel thing came later, to simplify timing/phase.
Some say VituixCAD is too challenging to learn, but if you were stuck in quarantine during during COVID-19, wondering if Government would let you out early because your dad is about to die, or if you had stay for the full 2 weeks because he made it after a coronary bypass, you too would try to take your mind off things.
By doing something else, like learning VituixCAD2, like I was able to.
Stress less about what you can’t do and have fun with what you can!
I just know what a speaker sounds like, and do better than I should absent vituixcad dogma.
I started into this hobby using Speaker Workshop. XSim is very similar, so it's what I gravitate to. I sometimes check things like target slopes in WinPCD, but that's pretty rare. I haven’t taken the dive into Vituixcad yet. It looks powerful, but a little daunting. I keep saying I'll block out the time, watch some tutorials and figure it out, but too many things seem to get in the way.
To be fair, it's not VituixCAD's dogma, VituixCAD is just a tool to pursue the findings of Toole, Harmon, Olive, etc. and take advantage of the information in spinorama measurements.
I could barely use PCD and decided to learn VituixCAD. If I can learn it, anyone can.
Unibox is great and still my first choice for a quick box model. The only thing I wish it had is a max SPL graph that incorporates excursion limits, like BassBox Pro. Alas, I lost access to my BBPro license when I gave up Parallels for a dedicated not-a-Mac audio software laptop. So I no longer use that software. (To date me, the first box modeling software I used was BlauBox!)
Aside from Unibox, I use REW Pro (5-channel: 4 mics to make polars go faster and a timing reference), and V-CAD (I think my review of an Amphion speaker for SECRETS may have been the first published spin from VCAD outside a hobbyist forum) most. There’s a hodgepodge of DSP programming software in use here as well: Harman London Architect (BSS) and Audio Architect (Crown DCIn), Powersoft Armonia+ (their little Mezzo amps are great), miniDSP Device Console and PWR-ICE plugins.
I wish FuzzMeasure were still viable because it is more elegant than REW. REW has grown on me though and is vastly more capable.
That’s it for DIY. For room correction, we use Dirac Live Bass Control in four setups (2x Monoprice HTP-1, 1x JBL SDP-55, most recently 1x Arcam AV41 as there’s an authorized dealer selling “B-stock” on eBay right now for under half of the current new street price), 1 with RoomPerfect, and one with Neumann MA-1 (layered under DLBC, which works well - Dirac basically leaves the mains untouched, but automates subwoofer integration.)
PS I can’t seem to find my WT2 software. My DATS v3 has been acting up (maybe because I don’t understand or like Windows) and I was thinking I should relearn how to use my old WT2. But I can’t find the download. Maybe I can contact you?
It does have a max spl with xmax. You have to click the tabs at the bottom for the right model.
I might be able to zip the last software version folder and email it to you. Shoot me a PM.
InDIYana Event Website
unibox. Also has graphs showing the port/box/leak contribution with vented alignments.
@Wolf - appreciate the WT2 offer! I couldn’t find the software on the S&L site.
I also agree Unibox gives you the information, with the red line for excursion-limited theoretical output, but I miss how BassBox Pro 6 combines that with theoretical max output for a given input into one plotted line. I have tweaked Unibox before to do that, but it’s a manual process of matching where the lines cross and copy-pasting the excursion limited data into the SPL for input column.
WinISD, ARTA, DATS v3, and Xsim.
Thanks again everybody, this is very helpful!